He had a habit of buying magazines that had swim suit models in them and he would read them at home. Soft porn. Then he was at one point going interstate with a group of his friends to see the football. After the game they were going out and may end up at a strip club.
She had a big problem with this and we discussed it at length. She had never mentioned to him that she had a problem with the magazines or his planned trip to the boudoir. Eventually she decided to discuss the matter with him. She asked him not to go to see the pole dancers on his football trip, he agreed and as it turned out he did not go. However in speaking with her she summed up many of the misconceptions some women have about the male psyche in this way.
Firstly it seems women differ considerably on this matter. Some women have the reaction as described above. I know other women who give their husbands a years subscription to Hustler magazine for a christmas present each year. Clearly they are not of the same view as the woman described above
Angst
As I mentioned in a previous post (generally speaking, and I know I am generalising here) for women sex and relationship are intimately intertwined. For men that can be the case but it does not have to be. Men can have sex without there being a relationship established or establishing. The most obvious example being prostitution and the fact that places like Hooters exists and magazines like Hustler can be so profitable.
Some of her misconceptions were.
1. Because he wants to look at naked women that means he wants to have sex with them.
2. Because he wants to look at naked women that means our relationship is no good.
3. Because he wants to look at naked women that means I must not be good enough for him.
4. When he looks at naked women he is comparing them to me.
Wrong!! I would argue that for most men these are not so.
Males when they turn into teenagers discover that when they look at a female who is sexually attractive it feels good. That’s it, end of story. It feels good so they look. They are not intelligent enough to think up the 4 things described above. It feels good so they look.
The male in one of his brighter moments at the Red Neck games
She now reports no angst about his swim suit model magazines.
Graffiti
Well Tony,
ReplyDeleteI guess i just can't get my head around that one. Also... i doubt if what you say is true. Too many men can't just look and feel good. *Giggles* I must say though, it is apparently the same for most women. It appears that they all like to be looked at and be the one looking.
You believe what you want, that's fine with me, but i'm willing to go on my own observations within the office, school, University - gosh, pretty much any public environment with this one.
Happy Wednesday!
Happy wednesday to you to roses and I am glad that you are fine with me believing what I want.
ReplyDeleteI am not too sure what you are actually disagreeing with. However Roses, take a trip down to your local newsagency and have a look in the magazine rack. I am sure you will find a plethora of magazines with half naked women in them a distinct dearth of magazines with half naked men in them.
Surely if women liked to look like men do then there would be people making money out of it in the same way.
Graffiti
I understand what you and Roses are both saying, but people are all different. I'm sure you are BOTH right. I would be curious to know which magazines enjoy the best sales numbers, though. Would it be those with naked men, or those with naked women? I have my guess, but as I am always fond of pointing out, women are not as a rule nicer, more decent, or less savage than men are. We are ALL animals when you get right down to it. Such is life.
ReplyDeleteI could not put that better my self Anon - Such is life.
ReplyDeleteI would assume that there is little demand for pictures of naked men in magazines. If there was demand then some one would be selling them.
Women nicer? In same sex peer relationships I would rather be a man. Its scary to watch how savage a group of women can be to each other.
Thanks for your comment
Graffiti
I meant Tony,
ReplyDelete...that looking is generally not where the 'good feeling' continues. Watch the culture of men and women who work in very public areas such as councils, schools.. places where men and women get to look a lot and pretty soon they get desensitized (sp?) and looking isn't enough of a good feeling anymore.
The 'teen' story was a good one however I would dare to say (assume) that teens don't stop at looking either. After a while the good feeling of simply looking wears thin and there is a need for a more thrilling 'good feeling' and is generally arranged as soon as possible.
You were a teen Tony, you know what i mean.
Had a great day to day too. Cheers...
I love the picture of "Angst" in action Tony.
ReplyDeleteYes perhaps different folks have different values when it comes to partners viewing soft porn and going to strip clubs. I like a statement you made once about "ownership" in relationships Tony. Partners do seem to gravitate towards "owning" each other at times. How can one "own" an attachment?
kenoath
I will agree with you on that one Roses about the desensitization.
ReplyDeleteI was once a teen Roses, that is not some thing that I could easily deny
Tony
Yes kenoath, our very own Prime Minister I think was caught in a pole dancing club in New York!
ReplyDeleteGood question, requesting a partner not do something. When does that stop being a request and starts to become an attempt at ownership of the other person.
Graffiti
I like to look at hot men - in real life and in photos. I don't compare my husband to them and it doesn't mean I don't love him and don't want to have sex with him. I do sometimes wonder what it would feel like to have sex with a young muscular good looking guy, but I would never act on that. So if my husband is thinking the same way, it's ok with me.
ReplyDelete"I will agree with you on that one Roses about the desensitization."
ReplyDeleteTony?
So, you advise or encourage (give permission for) them to look and then when they become desensitized and step beyond 'looking', how do you counsel the couple?
By the way,
Do you mind that i tackle you with questions here? If not just say so and i'll stop.
Cheers...
I appreciate this topic, as it's one I've wrestled with personally. I have caught several exes looking at porn on the computer, and was very upset. I've turned the issue over and over in my mind, trying to figure out whether I need to change my perspective, or whether what they were doing was indeed a violation. It certainly FEELS like a violation.
ReplyDeleteI find it problematic to base whether something is okay on it feeling good. Also, can't fidelity go beyond our genitals? Is it only cheating when intercourse happens?
If it's healthy for husbands to look at other naked women because it feels good, is it also healthy for wives to form non-sexual, emotionally intimate relationships with other men? (Just going with your mars/venus generalization, which I more or less agree with.) Maybe they just talk, and cuddle, because it feels good, but don't have sex. Is that cheating?
Would the husband be wrong to assume the following:
1. Because she wants to be emotionally intimate with other men, she wants to have sex with them.
2. Because she wants to be emotionally intimate with other men that means our relationship is no good.
3. Because she wants to be emotionally intimate with other men that means I must not be good enough for her.
4. When she she is emotionally intimate with other men she is comparing them to me.
I don't have an answer, really. I'm just curious about this, and trying to figure out where the proper boundaries are. It seems to be an age-old question.
Hi Roses,
ReplyDeleteI don't encourage or discourage them to look Roses. I simply listen to their explanation of what they are doing and then facilitate them coming to some understanding of the healthy and unhealthy consequences of what they are doing - assuming there are some. Then it is their decision to make about any changes in behaviour that may result.
Tony
Hi Harriet and Annabel,
ReplyDeleteYour comments have led to another part 2 post I want to make on this topic. I will probably do that tonite.
If I was counselling you Annabel, which I am not, then I would want to know about your sense of violation. How or what is the violation that you feel.
Graffiti
Men are not stupid Tony. They know what they're doing and they know what they want. If they can't get what they want they'll get what ever they can get. Women are no different.
ReplyDeleteYou make a good point. I did assume so much about what you do and say while i was reading this post and i am sorry for doing so.
Thank you for putting me straight.
I do look forward to your Pt 2 post on this subject.
The weather is just amazing Over and up here Tony. So nice...